She Didn’t Believe in Jesus Until One Moment Changed Everything

Friends, and welcome back to Faithfield Living.

This is your host, Kristen.

Today we're going to talk about a prayer that opened a Jewish heart to Jesus.

My guest wrote a book called the Hallway Miracle, and she's going to share with us what it was like being a Jewish woman who found Christ.

It's a beautiful story that I think most of us can relate to.

So whether you're somebody that's walked with Jesus for most of your life, or whether you're somebody that's questioning God, or maybe you're somebody that's just seeking a life that's full of peace and joy and.

And you just.

You.

You wanna know Jesus, but you're just not sure this is the episode for you.

I think it will encourage each of us in our faith journeys.

Welcome to Faith Fueled Living, the podcast that equips you to live well spiritually, emotionally, physically, and purposefully.

Each week, we'll dive into conversations and biblical truths to help you strengthen your faith, pursue meaningful work, care for your whole self, and live in line with what matters most.

I stay on the podcast.

I would like to welcome our guest author, Kara Shine.

We are gonna talk about her new book and her testimony, her testimony of being raised and then finding Christ.

And her book is called the Hallway Miracle, the prayer that opened a Jewish heart to Jesus.

And I know this conversation is just going to touch your heart because we're just going to talk about, you know, how God does amazing things in our lives and how we have such an opportunity every day to have impact in the world by letting God work through and with us.

And so I can't wait to share her story with you.

So, Kira, welcome to the show.

Thank you so much.

I'm so excited to be here with you and your listeners today and to see what God's going to do.

I love it.

Okay, so why don't you just first start off by telling us, like, what does life look like now?

And then, why did you decide to write this book?

Sure.

That's such a good place to start.

Sometimes people ask me to start at the very beginning, but it makes more sense to start where I am now, because in order to understand the impact of what God did in my life, it's.

It's good to fast forward and realize where I am today.

So today I live outside of D.C. and Northern Virginia with my husband.

We're coming up on 30 years of marriage, which is crazy.

And I am a retired elementary school teacher with masters in gift and talented education.

But my real passion, after I discovered who Jesus Was, was ministry.

So I also was director of children's ministry at my church for a really long time.

Now I am a youth leader.

I love working with high schoolers.

I lead Bible studies, and I'm a lay pastor at my church specifically, which in and of itself is crazy.

And I want to just start by saying I shouldn't be here at all.

Right?

I shouldn't be on your screen.

If not for the story in my book and what happened in my life, I would not be on a Christian podcast.

And I'm hoping that my story today resonates with any of your listeners who think their prayers are not heard by God or that God can't fix whatever situation they're in in his plan for their good.

And the reason I decided to write this story was I simply did not have a choice.

If I could be honest, God, I've told my story in smaller settings, either, you know, from the pulpit or in women's groups that needed encouragement.

And every time I share the story, I'm left with people who just say, Kara, you have got to tell this story.

You need to let people know the goodness of God and what they can do in their, in his, in their lives.

And I really didn't want to.

I was a little terrified because it is, it's hard to let the world know this is what happened to me.

But God actually had.

One day, this woman walked into a seminar I was teaching on anxiety.

And afterwards she just looked me square in the eye and she said, I think God wants me to help you.

And from that moment on, it was God wink after God wink, doors opening.

That shouldn't have been open to me.

A first time authority with, with this story.

And, and God just said, he took, took my hand and said, we're, we're getting this out to the world.

Case in point, here I am on your podcast about to share this story.

I love it.

And I, I so relate to that.

I mean, yes, I grew up in a, a Christian home, although I grew up Catholic initially.

And so, you know, same thing.

Like, you know, a lot of parallels and you know, it's, it's still Christian, but you have a lot of Christians that see that as not, you know, so it's all these, there's some parallels there, but I mean, not that I didn't know Christ.

I did, but you know what I'm saying, like the judgment sometimes of other Christians and different denominations, we tend to some people.

Right.

And then we'll get into your story about what you experienced when you were young.

With some Christian children.

But sometimes we aren't nice to each other.

Right.

And that is not who Christ is.

But I only say that to say that when I started my first podcast, it was actually more about building a life you love.

That's what it's called.

And so, yes, there was a faith aspect, but it wasn't a faith podcast.

But God kept calling me to actually talk about my faith, and I didn't want to either.

I mean, not in Interesting.

The whole show is about life rooted in faith.

And so I absolutely know what you mean, which is, I'm not a pastor's kid.

I'm not, like, I'm none of those things.

I haven't gone to seminary at this point.

And so it's the same thread that God was like, oh, no, I want to use you in this way, and I want you to get out of your comfort zone, and I want you to do this right.

I want you to share your story.

I want you to share other people's stories and testimony, and I want you to give glory to God.

Right.

And so I absolutely relate with you feeling like, well, I don't really know that I need to do this book.

But then just it was there, and God said, yes, this is another way.

I want to use you in your story.

So I love that.

Yeah.

The Bible's full of reluctant people who are afraid.

Right.

I joked with some of my friends that at times during the story, I felt like Jonah running away from Nineveh with my fingers in my ears, like, la, la, la, la, la, la.

Not me.

Yes.

Don't make me tell the story.

And then other times, I felt like Esther, you know, okay, I'm going to be brave for you.

I know you want me to do this.

I will be brave.

And then I jokingly said, if you take the word, you take Jonah and you put it with Esther and you squeeze it together, you get jester like a clown, which is how I felt a lot of times.

But I hope for any of your listeners that are thinking, like, why me?

I would just say, why not you?

There's.

There's this Hebrew word, hineni, which means, here I am.

Yeah.

And we hear Abraham saying it to God when God calls him outside to look at the stars, and he just simply says, here I am.

And we hear it again when he goes to sacrifice Isaac, when God calls him out.

And we hear it again when, you know, Moses is in front of the burning bush.

He says, kanani, here I am.

And for any of your listeners that are wondering, do I take that next step.

Do I write the book?

Do I go to a neighbor and pray with them?

Do I make the meal for the widow who's sad?

Do I stop and talk with the person, you know, if I'm a student, Do I look for the kid in the hallway who's lonely?

Kineni, like, offer.

Offer it up to God and say, use my life.

And it's amazing what God can do with just that one little response to, To.

To his calling with wonderful things.

And I hope that this story resonates with other people so that they.

They can step out of their comfort zone and take that.

Take that leap of faith for God's kingdom.

Absolutely.

Yeah.

I mean, that's the thing is one, we have to be willing, even if we're uncomfortable.

And two, we have.

Especially if we're uncomfortable, because if we're uncomfortable, it might mean that it's going to have kingdom impact.

That's right.

And then it's also.

But we have to be aware and present.

Right.

Like, how is God prompting us?

Where is he positioning us?

You know, in the day.

To day and then in a longer path?

And so.

Absolutely.

So I love that.

Okay, so why don't you start off with telling us a little bit of the backstory.

Right.

Of you want to maybe lay out, like, you're a teacher and sort of what starts to happen.

Set the stage about the way.

Sniper.

And then kind of your experience in the past with Christians when you were growing up.

Sure.

Okay.

So growing up, my dad was in the military, and that meant that we often had to live close to the military base.

And we.

This military base was in southwest Ohio, which was great because it was close to the base, but unfortunately, 45 minutes away from the nearest synagogue, because I grew up Jewish.

And that made us really one of the only Jewish families in an otherwise very Christian community.

And I know that there were wonderful Christians in our midst, but unfortunately, the Christians that my brother and I heard from the most on the school bus and at school were also the cruelest.

And they said really, really hateful things to us that scarred our hearts for years.

So, for instance, on the bus, I heard things like, oh, I hope you have lots of short sleeves and shorts because you're going to burn in hell.

Or, you know, one day I had a boy walk past me and grab a handful of my hair and announced to the bus, you know, checked her for horns.

All clear.

We're safe.

I'm 10 years old.

I'm just a little kid.

And then I had this other Girl that said, your parents must be ignorant if you don't believe in Jesus Christ.

And she would just hiss the name Jesus Christ at me.

And I knew there were other kids on the bus who didn't agree with that, but nobody spoke up.

And it was really confusing to me because when we made the 45 minute drive to synagogue, I remember one day somebody in Sunday school asked the rabbi, tell us about Jesus.

Like, who is this Jesus person?

And I remember and I loved this rabbi and I love, I love my Judaism.

I still do.

I love the traditions and the rituals and, you know, Rosh Hashanah and Yom Kippur and all that.

And so Sunday school, this boy asked, you know, Rabbi, tell us about this Jesus.

And the rabbi just looked very carefully, maybe he stroked his beard, maybe he didn't.

But I remember he said carefully, jesus was a wonderful rabbi and he should be respected.

And he gave us the golden rule, do unto others as you would have do unto you.

So I couldn't reconcile what this trusted rabbi was saying about Jesus with what these kids on the bus were saying.

And so for a good 30 years, I just assumed Jesus was not for me.

And worse yet, that Jesus wanted nothing to do with me, which couldn't have been further for the truth.

So fast forward.

I'm sorry, go ahead.

No, no, Well, I was just going to say, yeah, I mean, it is sad.

I mean, I think even people that have been a Christian for a long time or grown up in, in that faith, even we have seen Christians that act badly, maybe not to that level, because that's just terrible.

Right?

Because people can be mean to people, because people are not Christ.

Right.

And so the problem is, is that unfortunately sometimes Christianity gets a bad reputation because sometimes humans are judgmental, humans are not, you know, or Christ.

People that say they're Christian, but they're not walking in Christ's spirit when they're acting that way.

And unfortunately, sometimes you learn it from somewhere or you didn't truly build that relationship.

And we'll get into that later.

But so first of all, it's just, I'm so sorry that that happened to you, you know, and you're not the only one I know that that's, that's happened to.

But you know, that's the first thing, right?

If you call yourself a Christian, we have to do a better job, right?

Like you, you said it when we, before we recorded, like how we show up in the world, how we show up in love and kindness and service matters, in every moment.

The words we speak and so as a Christian, we have that responsibility to be aware of how we're acting.

And are we being more like Christ every day instead of nothing like his example?

That's.

It's so true.

Thank you for saying that.

And I was nervous about this book coming out now because we are at the height of some anti Semitism that we have never experienced since the Holocaust before.

And I don't think there are any coincidences.

And I keep saying I really hope that this book builds bridges between us and not walls.

And you're right.

And I have forgiven these children.

They were just children.

I have forgiven them because I needed forgiveness.

I recognized when I met Jesus.

Oh gosh, I'm just like the kids on the bus.

Maybe I haven't said something like that to somebody, but I have certainly carried sin in lots of other ways.

So I couldn't make room in my heart for Jesus until I forgave them.

And then I realized I needed the same forgiveness.

But I think it is important that we recognize where we are in the world today and how important that it is that we think about what we say and how we move in the world so that others can meet the real Jesus, not the Jesus that.

That can cause other people to be outside of his love.

And you said it beautifully too.

That's man.

And man is always going to disappoint.

But we're trying to follow Jesus.

Absolutely.

Okay.

So that was sort of one snapshot of when you were growing up, sort of this experience with some, you know, people on your bus.

So, you know, 10 year olds or if you will, and just messages that they were sharing were not true or correct.

But fast forward then to, you know, you start off the book more as you're a teacher.

Right.

And so you want to kind of set that up for us just a little bit.

Sure.

We were just a year outside of 9 11, which really rocked our world.

Not that it didn't for everybody, but for those of us living Outside of the D.C. area, we were only about 30 minutes from the Pentagon.

My dad was always.

He was at the Pentagon off and on.

We had as a teacher, I had students in my class whose parents were at the Pentagon when 911 happened.

And as a teacher, we were rocked as a school because we had to continue teaching throughout the day of 911 and pretending like nothing had gone on to keep the kids safe.

Our sole job was keep those kids safe.

So we had to lock down any emotions that we had continue on with the day and just pretend like everything was fine.

And there was trauma there for a lot of us, myself included.

The DC snipers turned out to be two.

Two men cut a hole in the back of their blue Chevrolet and for three weeks drove it around the District of Columbia, Maryland and Virginia, shooting at everything and anything they could.

It didn't matter.

You could be pumping gas, you could be loading groceries in your car, you could be walking the dog and all of a sudden they would shoot.

And after it was at the end of their three week reign, they ended up killing 10, wounding three, including a middle school child.

But they terrorized millions of us.

Our everyday life stopped.

We couldn't go outside anymore.

They told us if you do go outside, you have to duck and weave or stay low to the ground.

Like I said, pumping gas was a matter of life or death.

And I was a young mother at that time.

I had a two year old daughter, Emma.

And everything about what I knew in the world all of a sudden shifted and I started suffering from panic attacks.

And that's kind of where the story begins.

Yeah, I mean it's so understandable.

I mean if any of us, and most of us have experienced things where something takes a hold of us, right?

Fear or anxiety in varying levels.

Right.

Of what we've experienced.

But it's, it can really be very debilitating.

Right?

And like you said, it's like it consumes you.

Not every second because I've walked through.

I mean I, I didn't, I haven't always been an anxious person, but I've walked through seasons like that as well.

Like one of my sons came home from college a couple years ago.

It was after Covid with severe depression and other things.

And it's like, you know, for, for a couple years I every day like worried like, is he going to be here tomorrow?

You know, so.

But, but it started assuming me.

Not every second, but once again, it's like I couldn't let it go, you know, and obviously I kind of kept praying about it and praying for different things, right.

Like I can't control anything.

I can just pray for him.

I can try to be there for him.

Like I can do all these things, but at the end of the day I can't control driving down the street, right.

I can't control.

And I had to relinquish that control.

Like the feeling of being out of control to God.

Like I just had to give it up and be like, I need you to take this from me.

Right.

Like, because I, I can't keep holding on to that, that underlying anxiety.

Right.

It was just too much.

Like, you said too many things because just like the snipers, you couldn't.

It was out of your control.

But then every day you're worried, like, if somewhere I go is the wrong place, you know, and so.

Yeah, and so laying it at the foot of the cross too.

I'm sorry, no, like, laying it.

And as you're talking, I'm taking this all in and taking mental notes in my head because it is, it's so true.

It gets so, so heavy to carry and it consumes you and mentally sometimes, moment by moment.

God, take this, God, I lay it at your feet.

It is too heavy for me.

And some days are heavier than others.

And some days it's a minute by minute step.

And other days you can lay it down to the cross.

I've been recently praying prostrate on my face, which is a new position for me because in the middle of all of, you know, publishing this book and putting this book out, there was tremendous spiritual warfare on my family.

And that, that verse from James, you know, James 1:2.

Consider it joy, brothers, when you face trials of many kinds, because it produces perseverance.

I had heard that for years, and it wasn't until this, this past year that I really recognized exactly what you're saying, that when we're feeling anxious, that minute to minute surrender of what God, take this from me, it's too heavy for me.

And just laying completely surrendered on my face, right where I had nothing.

I have no strength of my own to stand and giving it to God just renewed me every morning, sometimes several times a day, to just give up your strength of even standing on your own two feet and laying it down in front of God.

Yeah.

Good reminder.

Thank you.

Yeah, I mean, it's so true.

I actually, over the last couple years, you know, every month, every year, I definitely deepen my faith in different ways.

And, you know, now every time I read a great prayer about anything, you know, like praying over your home, praying over your sons, praying over your spouse, like I write them in a book now so that I have the health.

And so now most days I will.

I don't go through the whole thing, but I maybe go through 30, 40 of them.

But it's, you know, just those prayers to give it up and give it over to him, but also like protection, all these things, because I didn't used to.

I would pray Before, Right.

But I didn't pray with as much intention as I do now.

Right.

As I've just gotten older, I've learned more, you know, about the power, right, of prayer, like a specific prayer.

So I love that you know, that you're doing that.

So why don't you tell us?

Okay, so you're a teacher.

You came in teaching, right.

You grew up Jewish.

And then what happens?

You're in the midst of all this anxiety, the Beltway Snipers, and you show up in your.

One of your closest friend at school's classroom.

And what happens?

Well, as God would have it, because he is bigger than we could imagine, God placed me in an elementary school that was full of the most wonderful Christians you could ever imagine.

I'm still very close with all of the teachers at that school.

When we think about that time period in that school, we all just are in awe at how beautiful this place was.

And it was really because the principal, his name was Rob, welcomed the Holy Spirit in openly and boldly into this elementary school.

Now, this is a public elementary school.

Now, again, this is a long time ago.

He didn't post it on Facebook.

He didn't tell anybody.

He just faithfully, quietly felt God saying to him, rob, claim this school in my name and I will do great things.

So he prayer walked around the school quietly on his own.

And I found out afterwards as well, he also, at night, after the kids would leave and the students and the teachers would leave, he would walk the hallways and lay hands on our doors and pray for us.

And he knew I was Jewish.

So when he would get to my classroom, he would actually go into my classroom and lay hands on my chair and my desk and pray over me.

I had no idea any of this was happening.

And I remember when I showed up feeling an immediate sense of calm.

For anyone who's not listening, I look ethnic like I do look ethnic.

And I showed up into a school full of people who were not ethnic.

They were very Christian.

But the way that these people and these teachers acted towards me and to each other softened my heart to their faith because they.

When I would bring my.

My matzah on peanut butter and jelly to the lunchroom during Passover because I wasn't eating any leavened bread, it was a completely different experience than what I had grown up with with the kids in the cafeteria, they were welcoming, they were kind, they had questions.

They actually.

There seemed to be almost a reverence for.

For what I was trying to do.

And it sparked conversations.

And then as my.

My early motherhood anxiety took took place and I had all these questions about what do I do with my baby when she cries all night and how do I.

They just filled this space and became my closest friends and confidants and specifically my one friend, Sharon, who was the teacher across the hallway from me.

She was always there for me in the middle of some really difficult times.

And during the Beltway sniper attacks, I ended up in her classroom several days.

And on one of those days, I recognized that she had done this one small little thing.

She had put a desk calendar on her desk full of Christian scripture and daily devotionals.

And I found myself sneaking in and reading them over her shoulder.

Things like, you know, from.

From John, peace I leave with you.

I do not give as the world gives.

You know, do not be afraid.

I didn't know who John was, but I loved this idea of not being afraid.

And I put these two things together.

Do not be afraid.

Fear not.

And I would sneak into her room and just read these verses for comfort.

She had no idea I was doing that.

And when she decided to put that desk calendar on her desk, I know she never in a million years thought that it would cause the heart of a Jewish woman to start to open just like these Beltway sniper.

There's no way they could have known that they're bullets and all that chaos would turn my life into a believer.

But God.

Right, but God.

You intended to harm me, but God intended it for good.

And that little desk calendar, along with the relational presence over persuasion relationships that I had with these Christians just began to soften my heart and make me wonder, wait a minute.

Maybe.

Maybe this Jesus is not who I think he is.

These are wonderful, good people.

And it.

It led me to a crossroads.

Before we get into that.

Right.

Like kind of you starting to explore the Christian faith.

You said something, I think that was really important.

Right.

Which is.

I'm probably not going to say it.

Right.

You said, I think, was it presence over persuasion?

Persuasion.

Persuasion, yeah.

And I think that's so important.

I get it.

There's some Christians, you know, it's all about evangelical, you know, trying to get more people to become Christians.

I don't see it as much that way in the sense of.

I don't see it as a persuasion.

I see it as if you just live right as best you can, like Christ.

People then say things like, how can you have peace?

When I only feel anxiety?

So for me, it's about living it, not about trying to push it down people's throats.

And I always, since I was young, felt conflicted by that, you know, because some people, you know, again, it's interpreted a certain way, certain denominations feel a certain way.

And I'm not trying to say God's word says this or that, but what I'm saying is from my perspective of the way that I live in the way that I was designed, that's how I've always thought that people come to Christ is through what you just said.

And I think it's really important for us to remember it's not about trying to push our faith or our faith lens on someone else.

It's about letting people see why it's different.

I think that's so important, for sure.

And I love that you said, like, for you, because we know that everybody interprets the word differently and feels called with different gifts.

And for me, my story is the same thing.

I can't speak for other Jews.

I can only speak to what happened for me.

And for me, the presence over persuasion was what my heart needed to heal because of the way I had grown up.

And I think it's.

It's important to remember that being able to just say to one another, I have this beautiful presence in my life.

And it makes me feel this kind of way, which is why I act differently.

Because let's be honest, most non believers are not going to walk face first into, you know, the Book of Matthew to read the Sermon on the Mount and be changed.

But they're going to meet us.

That's right.

They'll meet us first.

And I'm.

I met these Christians first before I let the words of the New Testament change my heart.

But I was never going to open up the New Testament with all that hurt that I carried unless there was presence over persuasion first.

Yeah, I'm not going to remember the statement or the quote, but I remember in one of Bob Goff's books, he says something like that, right?

Like we may be the only.

He doesn't use the word example, but example of Christ in the world for someone else.

Right.

Like our encounter, maybe the only encounter someone has with Christ initially, to your point.

That's right.

Yeah.

And so, you know, it's just so important.

And I Can't remember.

The Presence Over Persuasion is not an original by me.

I wish I could remember where I heard that.

But when it did, it pricked my heart immediately.

I was like, that's exactly what happened to me.

And.

And that's what this book is about.

It's about opening up our eyes to the kingdom impact we can have on other people when we realize we are the hands and feet of Jesus.

And the way people are going to meet Jesus is.

Is hopefully if we offer up our Hineni through.

Through.

Through us, you know, and then we just pray that there's.

The seeds are planted.

Yeah.

And so you were starting to say.

And somewhere I wrote down, you know, so I think having people around you that encourage you in your faith.

And so two things.

One, I think your school friends weren't just.

They weren't trying to encourage you, like, oh, become Christian.

I mean, yes, once you asked or you opened the door, they started, you know, slowly sharing with you, which you can share with us in a minute.

But also, they were just people of faith.

And like you said, they were also curious about your faith.

Even if you never became a Christian, they were still engaging you with you.

Right.

About faith.

And so what would you just say?

Like, what.

What did you walk through with them?

And then two, what would you say about just having people around you to help you grow in your faith?

For sure.

So during the Beltway sniper attacks, we also had another crisis in our family.

Our.

My daughter Emma, had a peanut reaction.

We didn't know she was allergic to peanuts.

But in the middle of school, in the middle of these sniper attacks, Rob came rushing down the hallway to tell me, you know, hey, there's something wrong with Emma.

You need to go to the hospital.

And that one event was kind of the precipice of my anxiety, where I realized I was completely out of control with my emotions.

Watching your child almost die in front of you changes you in ways that you could never imagine.

And in the middle of that, after we got home from the hospital, on our answering machine, there was this message from Sharon, the teacher with the desk calendar.

And she simply said, you know, Kara, I just wanted to call and see how you were.

I hope it's okay.

A bunch of us after school got together and prayed for you and your family and for Emma and I. I remember thinking to myself, whoa, these people who are not my family are acting like my family and they're praying for us.

I had just never experienced anything like that before.

And there's that again.

Presence over persuasion.

And just that, that small little message of we're praying for you, along with kindness and actions that matched their words, it made me, it made me question and wonder, what is that?

What is that?

And how do I, how do I find out what that is?

And as the story continues, and lots of other things I could never, I could never imagine that happened.

They held my hand through all of it and showed me what it looks like to follow Jesus.

Yeah, I love it.

So let me ask you this.

How would you describe showing growing up, right.

In synagogue?

Obviously we share the same God, the how and the, the, the relationship.

Obviously it splits when, you know, Christ came back.

Right.

So can you explain to us from your own perspective?

Right, because we're not trying to generalize Judaism and Christianity here for everyone.

No, but from your experience, like you knew God and so can you just tell us like what you experienced in synagogue or just like how you knew God or what experience with him versus when you then became a Christian?

What was different for you about that?

So I absolutely love my Judaism.

It gave me my faith, it gave me my first introduction to, to God.

And growing up, I got to do all kinds of wonderful things.

My favorite thing was sleepaway camp where my, my fellow campers would sit outside underneath the stars and, you know, hold our hands and, and sing songs of peace, you know, oh, say shalom.

All of these memories for me gave me this foundation for who God was.

A God to be revered, a God who loved us, A God of my people, a God who keeps you safe and a God you can run to.

So that has always been there for me.

I actually was a Sunday school teacher, which is where I came to understand that that was probably my gift.

And at one point I thought about becoming a rabbi because I always felt very spiritual.

So once I discovered who Jesus was, I liken it to.

Have you seen those videos of babies who get their, their first pair of glasses?

I think so, yeah.

So at first they're squirming, you know, the parents are trying to put the little new baby glasses on them and the babies are squirming and moving around like, I don't want the glasses, I don't want them.

And then once they finally get the glasses on these babies eyes and they look around, they go, whoa, that was there the whole time.

So for me it was this marrying of the two things that I love the most.

My Judaism and my understanding of a deep, deep faith in God and history and culture.

And then this, this completion of God also loves us so much that he would leave heaven and come down to be with us when we couldn't be there for each other and we couldn't save ourselves.

And there weren't enough things that I could control in my life that could get me to a place of peace, except Jesus.

So it was this moment of realization that I could.

I could.

I could marry these two things together.

One point, once I finally get my first New Testament and I open it up and as I'm reading through, I get to this verse in John that really helped me take the two puzzle pieces of my life and put them together, which is what I was struggling with for a long time.

And it was, you know, in the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

Right.

And you see what happens there.

In the beginning, the Word was with God, so Jesus was with God.

When I was standing outside in, you know, the middle of the field with my Jewish friends singing songs, God, God and Jesus were already there.

And then God was with God and was God.

So I.

These two things I love didn't need to be separated because they had been together from the beginning.

And it just closed this hole in my heart that had felt kind of, I guess, yearning for this.

This connection with.

With these two worlds.

And in that moment, after reading that verse, I finally went, oh, I see.

These things have to go together.

Which is why I think now when I teach Bible studies or with my high schoolers, I make sure that there's a foundational understanding of the Old Testament.

Yeah.

Because if we skip all of that, we really miss all of the awe that comes with our understanding of what Jesus did and how he's fulfilling all of the Messianic prophecies that we read about.

All through the Old Testament, there's this, like, waiting, waiting, waiting.

What's happening next?

And until you open the New Testament, you don't get the.

Oh, that's what happened next.

And that makes sense.

I can build my life on that.

So, yeah, being able to put those two things together, life changing for me, that's so good.

Yeah.

I mean, many of my close friends are Jewish.

Some of my.

One of my sons, some of his best friends in second grade are Jewish.

Like, I'm like, I'm with you.

One of my favorite classes, I took many religion classes in college.

You know, one was Judaism.

And I love, I love it.

Honestly, I. I see a real beauty in the Jewish tradition and their practices because it's so.

And don't wrong.

I understand there's different, you know, Orthodox and different types, but it's like, it's pretty clear.

Whereas I feel like with Christianity sometimes, yes, if we're all just followers of Christ, we can all agree to that, but sometimes all the denominations and interpretations can get a little bit overwhelming, right?

Like, you're like, oh, my gosh, like, if you start getting into all that.

And so I've always thought that it's very beautiful, right?

Just that it's, it's very clear.

Like we, you know, this is what we follow, right?

And so I've always loved that about Judaism and just how, like, I just interviewed a rabbi, actually.

It'll come out next month about, like, creating legacy and purpose and things because, you know, we align in those ways, right?

Just because we.

We don't get to God in the same way, it's still, you know, important messages.

And I've always thought there's so much wisdom to gain from Jewish rabbis, because I don't.

I love the pastors I listen to.

I love the books I read by them.

But you.

It's just a different way that they, you know, that they talk about certain things.

And so I think there's so much for us to gain from all of it.

And so many Christians don't do that, right?

There are Christians that do, right.

We want to go and dig into the Hebrew understanding or the word, like, but a lot of people don't do that, right?

And so I think they're missing a lot when we don't learn more, right.

I think on both sides, right.

I think there has to be, again, I keep talking about this idea of, like, building bridges.

And if you think about, you know, the two entry points of a bridge, on either side, there's an entry point and then you've got the chasm over.

Over the river.

And if, you know, different religions, if we're standing on either side and nobody ever moves, right?

Nobody ever makes that move to get across.

We can't ever understand how alike we really are.

Somebody has to move first.

Fortunately for us, Jesus did and made that move first.

But as for those of us who are living in the world, that's something that we have.

We have to get to know one another and explore without any kind of church or, you know, any kind of that church.

Hate that sometimes, well, meaningly, because we think we're trying to save people can.

Can be interpreted the wrong way.

It's funny, when you were talking about different religions and how it can be different faiths, honestly, when I first came to know Jesus and I started to explore, you Know, a church or a first Bible study.

I was blown away by the fact that there were different ways to worship Jesus.

And I had to learn.

There was others Presbyterian and there's Methodists and there's Baptist and there's Christian and then there's Catholic.

And I couldn't.

In my head, I was like, wait, aren't we just all believers?

Why can't we just all, like, get together on this one thing if we're all believers in Jesus, like, this should be easy.

And I was a little bit.

I remember I went to my first Bible study and I started.

I really thought I was going to walk into Eden is what I was thinking.

So when I got to my first Bible study and I. I met these wonderful women.

But then there was this sense that, oh, they're also.

They're still human.

There's still some underlying things that I was like, oh, so I'm still on earth, but I. I get.

I get to be with Jesus in his presence.

But it looks different for everybody.

That was a mind shift for me from Judaism where it was like, this is what it is.

This is who we are.

Right.

And then once we accept Jesus, it was like, well, it could be this or this or this is.

And I guess there's the same thing in Judaism, like you said, there's, you know, Orthodox, reform and all those things.

But, yeah, that was a little bit of a mind shift for me, too.

Yeah, I've always thought that, like, hold on.

I don't get it.

Like I said.

Yeah, yeah.

Like, I, I like you.

I said I'm a follower.

I'm a follower of Jesus.

Like, you know, whatever kind of Christian you want to call me, it doesn't really matter.

Right.

Because I've, you know, I've tried different churches, I've been to different church things like that.

So for me, it wasn't.

They're all beautiful.

Right.

And I think there's no issues.

They're different and different expression of how we show our faith in small ways, not big.

Right, Right.

So let me ask you, what would you just say, like, so as you're going, I'm in the.

In your book, obviously you're going through sort of your story and so your heart starts opening to, like, you know what?

I think I want to know more about Jesus.

I want to, like, relationship with them, you know, so you talked about a lot of.

It was through the friends at school that were Christians.

But what would you just say allowed you to say, you know what?

I'm gonna, I'm gonna Do something that I'm not used to, I'm not comfortable with.

Right.

I grew up.

I don't dislike my Jewish faith, but I. I feel this call to kind of learn about him, to.

To know him.

So what let you take that first step to, like, just get curious and do something more about it?

Well, so the big event of the book that kind of sparks the rest of the.

The only things I can describe as miracles is this hallway miracle moment.

On one of the mornings during the sniper attacks, I got to school early.

I was one of the first ones in the parking lot.

And as I pulled into the parking lot, on the radio, they were announcing that a middle school boy had just been shot getting out of his aunt's car in the middle school parking lot.

And.

And it rocked me.

I sat frozen in my car with my teacher bag, thinking, how am I going to get from my car into the elementary school?

The anxiety of Emma's peanut allergy, the trauma from 9 11, everything that was going on was just stuck in my head and I couldn't move.

And as God would have it on that morning, my friend Sharon happened to come to school early as well.

So she was the second car in the parking lot.

And she pulled up next to me, and I looked over at her, and she was singing in her car.

We've talked about this before.

She and I are still very close.

She's actually in the Bible study now that I lead.

And we've talked about this moment before.

She doesn't remember what she was singing.

I'm going to say it was a worship song, but she was singing.

So I'm frozen in my car.

I can't move, I can't get out.

Here comes Sharon and she's singing.

She parked her car, she reached for the door handle, grabbed her teacher bag and just walked straight into school.

No ducking, no weaving, just right into school with a confidence that I couldn't comprehend.

And when she got to school, she kind of turned around and she saw that I was frozen.

So she just held the door open and kind of beckoned to me.

Come on, Kara, let's go.

And in that moment, I had to make a decision.

I was like, well, I have to get into school.

What am I going to do?

And God gave me the verses that I had been consuming from her desk calendar on repeat in my head.

And I formed them into this strange little verse the best I could.

Fear not, do not be afraid.

Fear not, do not be afraid.

Fear not do.

But it was my cadence.

And I ran with those Words from her desk calendar into the school.

And when I got into the school, I just looked at her and she was smiling.

And I said, sharon, aren't you afraid?

And she said, yes, I am afraid.

But I also know that God is in control and that Jesus.

Jesus loves me and.

And it's going to all be okay.

And I was shaken and I was anxious and I was desperate for hope.

And I just looked at her.

And because she had shown me through words and actions that she was a trusted friend and different than the kids on the bus, I asked her this question.

I said, sharon, I don't understand what that means.

And if your listeners haven't heard anything else I've said, this is the most important moment.

She had already spoken into my life.

She had lived faithfully and shown me what it looked like to be a Christian.

And there was trust there.

There was that presence over persuasion.

So the next question she asked did not scare me.

She just looked at me and she said, kara, would you like to pray with me?

And that was a bold thing for her to say.

Now, we were the first ones there.

So it was an empty hallway.

And I made that decision in that moment.

I needed hope.

She looked and lived differently, and I wanted to know more about what that looked like.

So I took a leap and I said, yes.

And she took my hands and bowed her head, and I did the same thing.

And I get goosebumps when I think about it.

She spoke to Jesus like he was her best friend.

And I felt it from the top of my head to the bottom of my toes.

And the hallway disappeared.

Sorry.

And when I opened my eyes, it felt like we had been there forever.

I opened my eyes, I just looked at her and I said, sharon, what was that?

And she said, oh, honey, that was Jesus.

And it changed everything.

It set off what I like to call the holy ripple effect, which I. I talk about in the story of all the other just crazy things that happened as a result of that prayer.

And it changed my life, the course of my family's life, the kids that, you know, hundreds of kids I've gotten to, to teach and share the gospel with, just that, that one moment, that one prayer.

And for your listeners, wherever you are, whatever you're feeling desperate about, whatever it is that is breaking your heart, and you've been praying and praying and praying for years, don't stop praying.

I promise you.

God hears your prayers.

I promise God can turn ashes into beauty.

Don't give up just.

Just because the world isn't feeling like the answer to your prayer right now.

Don't give up.

God hears all of prayers and he can do anything at any time with any of our lives.

All just that.

Hinnani, offer up your life.

Oh, I love it.

Yes.

Thank you for sharing that.

You know, very like the crux of, you know, the story or at least that part of it where it shifted.

Yeah.

So what would you just say?

So obviously then the journey continues where you kind of like keep growing in your faith as a Christian and being comfortable to share that.

Right.

Like becoming a Jewish woman who's now a Jesus follower.

So is there anything you just share with us about that?

Because I think a lot of people, if they've either grown up like, well, something bad happened to me, so Jesus, I.

Or you know, I just can't, like, I just don't know that I can come back to you.

Or for people that might be other faith, they've grown up in other faiths.

What would you just say to them if they're just starting to like, you know, maybe there's more.

Maybe this story is making me think like there's something more here for me.

What would you just how would you encourage them?

I think for the seeker, the most important thing to do is to recognize your seek.

Right.

We're not seeking unless we're lost.

If I'm, if I'm using ways and it's telling me where to go, it's because I'm on the right path.

But if I'm somebody that when I wake up in the morning I'm feeling lost, it's because the path is missing for you.

Right.

There's that analogy of that God shaped hole in our heart that can only be filled by God.

And we spend so much time and energy seeking the world to try and help us find that path.

But when, if there's something in your life that's making you feel lost, it's probably because you're not following God, you're not following Jesus.

There's a rabbinical saying that describes the relationship between a rabbi and a Talmud, a student, a rabbi and a student, and it's may you be covered in the dust of your rabbi sandals, meaning that you followed the rabbi, in our case Jesus, so closely that if he stopped walking, you would bump into his back and so you would be covered by his dust.

And if we think about it from that perspective, if, if you feel lost, it's because you might be following the wrong thing.

So maybe ask yourself, what is it that I need to stop following and open up my eyes to seek a different source altogether.

If you know somebody who has faith in their life, ask them.

Ask them, where do you find your faith?

Or most importantly, who are you following?

And then let that seek into your heart.

Absolutely.

Yeah.

And I've interviewed so many people where they had a season, you know, a lot, often in their 20s, but it could be any age where they.

They went down every path.

Right.

Like, oh, I thought it was new age.

I thought it was spirituality.

I thought it was all these things.

And then, of course, eventually the women I talked to, you know, found out.

That it was Christ.

Right.

Like, in other words, the thing that they were seeking and none of it was quite working, right.

It wasn't quite filling them, it wasn't quite giving them that.

It never does, right?

It never does.

No, no.

And so to your point, there's so many people, like you said, you said it so well about if you're seeking, right.

It may be it's just that you're seeking something that's not actually right.

It's not the light, it's not the living water.

And so, you know, like you said, it's just about being curious and then have having an open heart and going and talking to people or going.

I mean, nowadays you don't even have to have a physical Bible.

I mean, I.

You can go online and you can just say, like, what's a scripture about?

Right.

Anxiety or about.

And just get curious.

Like, just read it.

In other words, whatever point you're at, I mean, obviously more listeners listening to this podcast are going to be people that already know Jesus.

But that's not always true because I have all different topics that I cover.

So, you know, what episode is going to, you know, come across someone that maybe just needed your encouragement or they needed to, like, say, you know what, I've been really angry at God, or, you know, I'm just not sure I believe this or that.

Right.

And so sometimes we don't know how.

Just like your book, you don't know how our message, our conversation is going to get to the person that needs to hear it, wherever they're at on their faith journey.

So, yeah, I love how you said that.

So good.

Yeah, yeah.

I think it's also important to look back and reflect on our lives in ways that allow growth.

If we keep continuing on the same path and expecting different results, chances are we're going to run into a wall.

But I think about, like, you know, Joshua crossing over the Jordan with the Israelites finally into the promised land.

Before he does that, he he says to the tribes, stop what you're doing and.

And.

And pick up a stone and let's build a memorial that we can remember what God has done here.

And I think when we.

When we are reflective about where we are in our lives, a lot of times we have to look backwards and say, okay, what.

How did I end up here?

How did I end up in a place where either I feel fulfilled and I'm on the path, or something's missing.

And it could be because somebody in your life was a kid on the bus and misrepresented who Jesus was to you.

And being able to remind yourself that humans make mistakes all the time, but we're not trying to follow humans.

We're trying to follow Jesus.

So offering up your hurt in a way that allows you to think about, how do I move forward and change my direction, I think is really important in order for growth so that we can.

We can stay on the path and be covered in the dust, as it were.

Yeah, absolutely.

I love that.

Okay, so what would be just your last message of hope or encouragement as we wrap up this conversation?

I think that, you know, God can do anything.

God can do anything.

You know, this has been a rough year for my family.

My dad is 83 years old, and he's had three falls this year.

Each one resulted in a surgery and a stint and rehab.

One of them actually occurred on Christmas Eve.

So I had all these plans for our Christmas Eve and, you know, color quoted, you know, plates and napkins and all things, and we ended up in the hospital with my dad instead.

Now, my dad and my mom have been so supportive of my journey.

I'm very blessed.

It was.

It was a rough go.

And I talk about this in the book, in the beginning, 25 years later, now they're in a different place.

And when I do get to preach, they come and listen.

They love the book.

And on this particular fall, my husband and I left the hospital to just get a breath of fresh air, because it had just been a lot that day.

And we walked outside, and this is December 24th, right in Northern Virginia.

It's cold, it's gray, it's damp.

We're at the hospital with my dad, and we walked outside and we looked up and there was a rainbow in the sky on Christmas Eve, like a Christmas Eve rainbow.

And I just.

It reminded me again, there were so many times in my life where I'm feeling hopeless, I'm feeling sad.

And then God takes me to a hallway or to a hospital parking lot, and God can just show up anywhere if our eyes are open.

And wherever you are today, whatever's going on in your life, your children's life, your financial future, there is hope.

God can.

God can do beautiful things with your life.

Open your eyes, pray to Jesus, ask God to just stay with you and show you.

And you may not get a Christmas rainbow, but you have something better, right?

You have the presence of Jesus at any time.

At any time.

I love it.

Okay, so last question.

What would you just say is fueling you right now?

Oh my goodness.

My high school Bible study.

Are you kidding me?

These kids.

So this is crazy.

Here's some hope for, for anyone who's listening.

We started this high school Bible study ministry years ago, about five years ago.

And our, our, we have a coffee shop attached to our church.

So it was a good way to get the kids to come before school.

Before they went out to school, we'd give them a little coffee and feed them some waffles and bagels and we'd have some scripture time and Bible study.

We started with about 15 kids.

This past Tuesday, we had 55 kids show up before school.

I don't know about you, but when I was heading to school and high school, I wasn't waking up one second earlier than I needed to.

These 50 plus kids show up to hear the word of God before they went to school so that they could share it with others.

This generation is on fire.

There is revival moving and they are sharing with others.

And the reason that other people are coming isn't because of what we're doing.

It's because these kids are going out into their community, back into high school and saying, you know what?

Jesus has changed my life.

There's something here.

It's the same thing Sharon did with me.

Yeah, presence over persuasion.

Right?

And they're.

And, and it's, it's attracting kids who are lost because this generation has come to the end of themselves way sooner than you and I did because they see everything on their phones and in some ways it's really dark.

But in other ways, it's brought this generation to their knees faster, which is like we know sometimes the best place for you to meet Jesus.

So I am on fire for these kids and anyone who's out there thinking that this generation is lost.

I'm telling you, they're going to save us.

Jesus is going to save us.

They're going to help us.

Oh, I love that.

So good.

Okay, well, thank you for coming on and sharing, you know, part of your story and a little bit about the book and just sharing your heart for Jesus.

And just like you said, how do we build bridges?

How do we keep growing in our faith?

How do we say yes to the relationship with Jesus?

So thank you for sharing all that.

And can you share with us?

How can people find out more about the book and you know, just where, where they can connect with you?

Sure.

So I always say, you know, Amazon obviously is the easiest place to find the hallway miracle.

But if you have a local mom and pop shop, bless them, go in and ask them to order it for you because that's, that's just something that we can do to bless them.

You can wanna connect with me.

KarashineAuthor is my Instagram and then Karashine.com is my website and I love to hear from people.

Wonderful.

Well, thank you so much for sharing your story, for writing this book and for joining us today.

Thank you so much.

It was a pleasure and an honor.

As we wrap up today's episode, I did wanna let you know, if you haven't already grabbed my joyful living 15 day devotional, go grab it.

It's completely free from my website.

Just head to KristinFitch.com and it's at the top of my workbooks page.

But with that, you'll also be signed up for my email newsletter that I send most Fridays called Faith Friday.

That just helps encourage you in your life in all facets and just gives you a little bit of scripture and questions to ponder and think about.

I think it'll encourage you, I think it'll help you see Christ move in your life more and it'll help you tap into the fruit of the spirit that we're promised.

If you enjoyed today's episode, if you like, could leave a rating review on Apple Podcast or wherever you listen to podcasts.

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